Fibromyalgia Information and Advice

[Lady Nimue]

I was researching Methionine dl...and amino acid that is used to treat strat crystals in cats urine. My 2 cats have been aking it for years...but I was really surprised to read that it is used to treat Fibromyalgia.

http://www.arthritis-pain-cure.com/dlme ... a-347.html

Please let me know what yall think.

[Twig]

MSM doesn't do much for me, but there are other people who have benefitted from it.

What helps with pain is so individual, and we each have different thresholds with which we are willing to deal. No silver bullets!

[Sungmanitu]

I do not know much about FM, what I do understand in the western world of Medicine is that nothing gets researched hardly untill it can bring in money from the drugs used in the so called treatments.

MSM works a little bit for allot of people with FM but only reduces pain. One can also try trigger poiont massagfe on top of this.

FM like MS has all the ear marks of a bacterial/viaral infection.

Some virus' when not able to obtain certain proteins will retreat into the nerve endings untill that protien returns in the body.

Parasitology, parasites. You would do more to look up disease caused by virus' and bacteria and cross reference your signs and symptoms with those findings.

If I had FM I would try Hyaluronic Acid for th eplural spaces in my body trying to replace senoviol fluids lost as this is basically what Hyaluronic Acid is, joint and eye fluid.

I would also try combination teas like green tea that has the caffiene in it along with Ginger tea, both are antinflammatory and will reduce swelling and pain. Ginger itself is also a parasite killer and cancer killer. Studies have shown Ginger to have Apoptotic ability in cancer cell lines as well as proving to kill ovarian cancer cells.

A hint on dealing with disease and pain. All pain has many culprits, they come with names like cox-2, arachadonic acid, histemines, luekotrienes, etc,,,

Also take note of what you eat and drink, coffee is an inflammatory and depletes bonemarrow.

If you want to learn how to fight a disease or cronich pain symptoms look up what biological chemicals are involved.

Selenium will rebuild connective tissues and this can be found in the herb horsetail, though Thyme aka Thymus Vulgaris is safer for every one to us. Selenium is an activater for our connective fibroblast's to get to work repairing tissue that is dammaged but in order to do this you must deal with inflammation first.We spent 30 years mapping th ehuman genome only to have more disease and more wide spread cancer in the western world.

Red clover is a nice one for dealing with inflammtion too, dont take on a day your working or going for a drive.

Red clove works like nitro in the body when fresh and untill you get use to it, it will just scare you. No worries if you stay gmo free.

[Lady Nimue]

Good to have your contributions inthis forum, Sungmanitu.
You are a great resource.

[Sungmanitu]

You guys, any of you keep a journal?

What you eat, drink and do during the day evening and nights?

what seems to make it worse, better, indiferent?

then compare your notes?

Disease doesn't just happen just like pain has no source or reason.

What kinds of foods, how you prepare the food, fresh, canned/boxed, do you buy it at the store, grow it, what kind of work do you do, do you live in major cities, small city or large, or small town.

Tap water, well water, bottled water. Industry near by, ma&pa kettle out on the farm, gasoline driven car or diesel?

Doctor's only ask for what their tought to ask for.

Is it a toxicology issue, environment? If your not all related then how can they say it is congenital, heavy metal toxicity? what kinds of jobs, cleaning? industrial? anything that some where along the way would exspose some one to certain chemicals.
Even in cancer there are always normal chemicals that normaly do a job in a multiplicty when the body is healthy but in cancer those chemicl levels go through the roof.

[Jaguar]

I have kept a food diary, as well as an activity diary. I eat an anti-inflammatory diet, avoid all foods that can up arachadonic acid and increase leukotrienes, take supplements to support my system, did an extensive year long food allergy testing for food sensitivities and elimanted ones that make me react, eat foods that promote alkalinity and reduce acidity in my tissues. There are definitely foods that exacerbate my symptoms, and it varies depending on the time of year as well. In my own case, I have a history of a lot of severe injuries, which is common in FM clients. I also have many of the secondary conditions, like ulcerative colitis, candida, etc. I'm parasite free however (tests confirm this), so that is not a cause for me. Newest reseach points towards a hyperactivity in the brain that hightens pain receptors in the body. In FM clients, we simply don't have the ability to shut that reaction off, hence the abundance of tender points and high muscle pain. The receptors are more sensitive. Reducing the things in your diet and life that cause inflammation and the production of pain chemicals is essential, and the best thing you can do for yourself when you have FM is to exercise, especially hydrotherapy. It's hard to follow though, when pain and exhaustion are high. Gentle is the key word.

All in all, each client is unique, and finding what combination of therapies will bring relief and build health has to be approached in that manner as well.

I have to say Sungmanitu, that I have never seen Red Clover affect anyone the way you mention in my years of practice. It's one of the most gentle herbs out there - it's even safe for babies and gets used a lot for them when there are skin issues involved. I'd be interested in hearing about your experiences with this plant since they are so different from my own.

[Sungmanitu]

First time I used clover it nailed me, I looked it up and found it has 13 vasodilating chemicals in it. I tried it for the first time 4 years ago before going to work. Before I started shift I noticed my legs felt like lead, I looked in a mirror at work, the whites of my eyes were blood shot like I had been drinking all night. took a few hours for it to go away, pulse was regular and a bit shallow.

I do have a herniated disk at C-7 into T-1, I have been able to treat that with Ginger and Turmeric very well and when I have the cash I'm able to toss in some type 2 callagen then it goes from a small anoyance to not noticeable.

Thats the fresh herb, I noticed a huge diference between what you buy in a store and what you pick. This has been the only "Oh my God" with herbs that has ever happened.

Freshness is truly everything. I had that happen the first time I used it. I had no other herbs in with the tea I made, my body doesn't seem to do well with capsules. I never notice or feel a benefit with capsules, tinctures seem to work well though. Your the first person I've ever come across that watches their signs and symptoms like this.

Have you ever noticed any thing similar in any one else with FM?
Work environment and such?

As far as Red Clover, I don't know what it is other than the vaso chem's, I use other herbs that have equal to or a little greater than the clover but it's the only one that does it to me. I've come to use that on nights I cant sleep, mix it in with St. John's wort.

Other than that it's the only thing I've ever reacted to in such a way. When the neck injury happened I took all th epain killer's they had, didn't work as good as the naturals.

Usually I have a high tolerance to pain, my 10 on a 1-10 is usaully some one else's 15 or 20.

The best I notced for the neck is green tea with the ginger. Full range of motion no binding.

http://sun.ars-grin.gov:8080/npgspub/xs ... l?taxon=18

This is whats in yarrow, its activities

[Jaguar]

That's really interesting that you had that reaction to it. There's no doubt that is a very good blood and lymphatic purifier, but it's so gentle. I've never seen that kind of reaction. Your body must have really needed it, then.

I generally harvest my own herbs, and they are definitely better than you can buy from most stores. Ther eare some good companies though. Tinctures are often better than capsules because they get absorbed faster, and some of the herb's constituents are alkaloids that have to be dissolved in alcohol in order to be absorbed. My pain tolerance is really high as well, and I also build up tolerances to pain meds quickly. For me, EFA's have been a lifesaver for inflammation - fish oil and evening primrose.

I have to watch my signs and symptoms like a hawk. I have a couple of conditions that really act up if my body gets too acidic, so I track everything, lol.

When I had my practice I noted that people with FM are often overly sensitive in general. For instance, I can't walk down the candle aisle without having an asthmatic reaction. Household cleaners can do the same thing to me. When I put clients with FM on anything, I always had them start small and gradually increase the dosage to avoid a strong reaction.

Tumeric and ginger are great anti-inflammatories. I use them too. I'm glad they work so well for you.

[Sungmanitu]

Sounds like allot of it is chemical reaction then.
Doesnt surprise me, it's all chemical in the end.

My wife rcently passed due to Hospital screw ups and
Docotr ego's. She had been diagnosed terminal back in 04 with cancer.

I had been bouncing around the web in the dark findin things and answers that work. Cancer when not parasitic is chemical instability.

We even got into a fight littereally with one of the Doctor's on if it were even cancer because she should have been dead long before with out their help.

She was hospitalised over a bladdet infection. She was given Oxycodone Apap along with amox/clavu. Turned out after talking to a pharmacist that the oxy will cause kidney failure if taken when the body has an infection, the other drugs they gave work only for lung infections.

Then in the hospital they overdosed her on blood thinner's twice and sent her home to die. She proved the books right, blood acids, her blood turned acidic the tumors they were not even sure were tumors took off and that was it.

She has been dead now for just over two months. I know three Doctor's of western medicine that personally feel cheated. They want me to sue, not for money but for justice. Truth is, I cant, I know me, I can't handle that, I'd wind up in prison because it wouldn't even get to a court room.

Some day when things calm down I will finally get the schooling done and I will give all the information about the chemicals involved in cancer away to any who wants them.

The reason why I ask about the chemicals involved and about your blood work is I found that the same chemicals in gout are also in cancer, just expressed diferently and in a diferent location in the body.

Endometrioses, Aromatase inhibitor, IE Thymus Vulgarus,
Alkaline Phosphotase, yarrow works great against that y keeping it at normal levels. But the best combinations that worked were the parasite cleans herbs.

She was exsposed to something. Allot of her friends from high school wre either already dying from it when she first found out or were going through the beginnings of it. She was first diagnosed in 98.
We didn't see Doctor's that were happy or curious as to why she was alive for so long with no change in condition, they were angry.

I have her medical records from this last stay though they wont cut loose with the nursing records, the shift by shift charting, I do have her medication profile. They did her no favors.

Most Doctors wont even tell peopel chemo destroys their bonemarrow.

Good books I found during this time, Killer Germs and Genome.

Dr. Dukes Phytochemical Ethnobotanical Database.

And to all who have lost some one, I know it sucks when you can't hold their hand any more. But I know for a fact she is still with me.

We talk allot, I still see her, smell her, I can still feel her touch but not like it use to be. very very diferent now of course.
But the love I feel from her every day is so strong, its amazing, like a perfect unconditional feeling.

All I can say to other's is, try and calm your self and relax.
When we get ourselves out of the way, then it comes.

Smells sensations, memories you dont remember untill it is brought out, seeing, hearing, feeling. Just relax and allow yourself this space.

Your allowed, its about the love not anything else.

We were not the only ones cheated. Learn about your diseases, get what info you feel you need from the Doctor but mostly keep talking to each other, you'll find out what works. But it is a life style change. You have to look at all the things that you've done that helped it along. Then do everything the oposite. It caosts allot of money to eat real food. If you have family that is in the way or wont help, get them out of your life.

If you are facing death and you don't want to fight, thats ok too, it's your choice.
I always knew we go on, my wife showed that to three of us after she left.

Young, strong, she did answer that she can still feel the wind, smell the tree's and touch water. She doesn't get cold or overly hot either.

All the benefits with out the hassles. And no, we needed no psychics to see or hear her.

It was one on one personal and verifiable.

And like she said, you take the love with you, every thing that was good and loved comes with you.

[kyrie]

Sungmanitu, first, I would like to say that I am sorry that you lost your wife. Thank you for adding your thoughts here.

I have stage 4 breast cancer and also have FM, believed to have been brought on by the cancer treatments. I have been in pain for so long I hardly remember what it's like to not be. I took Lyrica for a while, and while it did help, I just cannot afford it. Shortly before Christmas, and while still on Lyrica, I went into a severe flare, which I am still in. My pain doc wants to do steroid injections in my back so that I can at least function, but now I have issues with my insurance.

To top it off, my onc has retired, and I now have a new one who wants to do a lumpectomy (I have been stable for over a year, with my tumor not growing but not going away either.) While I am ok with this, my family thinks that my first onc knew what he was doing in not doing any surgery at all, so I dunno... still a lot to think about, both pro and con.

Back to the Fm.. I have not done any food journals or anything like that... I just don't have the energy to keep up with it, and I have not been eating well as it is and have lost 20 lbs in the last couple of months... I have found that accupuncture works well, but again, is cost prohibitive for me. I make myself take my 5 yo to the park every weekend that it is nice, so that I can get some exercise as well, and I do my best to try and rest, though I am starting to not sleep well again.

I would really love to be able to try more natural remedies for both the FM and cancer side effects, but I have to be very careful that anything I take does not interfere with my current meds or chemo. Makes it very hard to figure out what is good and what isn't. Plus, I don't have much energy and my attention span tends to wander... I guess what I'm getting at is that if you or anyone else knows of how to learn more about natural forms of treatment, or practitioners, books, whatever that would be a good place to start, that does not have a lot of difficult explanations and that is easy to understand, I know I would really appreciate the help. Also, cost has to be a consideration.... I live in a small town, and many of the natural supplements and "healthy" food is really expensive...

It's all very frustrating...

Thanks!

[Sungmanitu]

Turmeric Spice, the body can take up to 8,000miligrams before it becomes toxic to us know your enemy, dont be afraid to give it a name. Cancer canonly live in high acid blood environment the biggest and fastes way to change this is

Asparagus, its the fastes and most potent alkalizer there is in the natural world that you can afford,

Also, http://www.herbalhealer.com
the four herb tea, also known as Essiac, a family member asked me what to do for a friend of hers who had terminal lung cancer. The cancer is gone now.

Essiac cleanses the blood and gives your body the head start it needs. To make the tea yourself its about 24 dollars to make two gallons, follow the directions.

There is a book called Calling of an Angel by Gary Glum it cost me 55 dollars and their getting harder to find.

Another book called Alkalize or Die is a great one. You cnat fight cancer head on, but you can change its world in order to kill it.

Nf-Kappa B, Alkaline Phosphotase, I've looked and looked, it doenst matter what cancer you have, all these chemicals are through the roof.

Ginger is most likely the most powerfull natural COX-2 Inhibitor in the natural world, that with turmeric and the essiac/4 herb tea.

As long as you breath its not over!!!!!!!!

One thing found out about the essiac, its doesnt help the body much once chemo is in play and surgey will spread the cells.

One tumor the size of a pea can house up to one million cancer cells. Dont let them cut, it is your choice but a tumor is not entirely bad, its in a way contained aswell.

Uusaully the body will creat a Granuloma, basically a tumor to house something it can kill or get rid of, remember its not having cancer that kills you, its cancer spreading.

Increase your omega -3' big time, flax has a P-21 inducer in it aswell as Apoptotic activitiy!!!!!


Words to know, Apoptosis, P-21 inducer, P-53 wildtype

Apigenin found in Garlic is a p-21 inducer and a apoptotic,

Since it looks like you did chemo try the essiac any ways, it may just take more by volumn, it aint over till its over!!

A book that you can afford is HEALTH THROUGH GODS PHARMACY BY MARIA TREBEN, HERBAL HEALER ACADEMY I FOUND HAS THE FRESHEST HERBS WHEN IVE HAD TO ORDER THEM, FRESHNESS IS EVERYTHING. TRY AND STAY CALM AND PUT YOUR MIND IN A PEACEFULL PLACE WHEN YOU CAN.

Truth is, after what I saw, I'm not sure I would want to fight it, but thats my view, stay strong, relax as much as possible.

KICK ASS GIRL, IT AINT OVER TILL ITS OVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111

http://www.aapsj.org/view.asp?art=aapsj080352

[Sungmanitu]

For lung cancer Treben states that Yarrow tea, four cups a day and chewing on calamus roots through the day, calamus tastes like crap though.

Maria Trebens book is the fastes way for you to go.

Remember, its your choice and your body "THEY" cant make you do anything, patient has a right to refuse care at any time.

Ask for the results of your blood tests, you want exact coppies of the reposrts including the blood work. Take the reports that show elevated levels of the blood look them up,


http://www.cancersupportivecare.com/est ... discussion


The site pasted above talks about herbs used in Endometriosis and shows those studies, dont think you need massive levels of a certain chemical from an herb, remember, herbs are not silver bullets, their more like Daisy Cutters, Drugs put black tape over the idiot light on the dash while herbs fix the engine.

I trust herbal healer on their quality of herbs, theres allot of fruad on the herbal market, be carefull who you buy from.

Once you start using herbs you know who not to buy from simply by tatse, smell and how effective it was campared to the last place you bought.

You can type into your search engine Dr. Dukes Phytochemical Ethnobotanical Database, I can never remember the site address.

Yarrow is loaded with all kinds of things that kill cancer, even the mayo clinic said its takes four cups of green tea a day to have a theraputic result, same with yarrow, space it through the day, don't drown yourself in your own lungs.

[eaglesfurr]

I joined this forum to find info about druids and here I am doing what I set out to do one year ago. Spread the word that help is out there.
I think I could say I've taken just about everything in the RX world to help my pain and fatigue. Even Lyrica before it was approved. I traveled 9 hours drive to see a DR. who would give it to me in 2005.
It supposedly helps some, but the side effects I endured for the 3 months is testimony to my despiration. Dizzy, couldn't speak a correct sentence etc. Some of the pain went away but I gained back 45 of the 65 pounds I had lost after a doctor put me on Elavil.
Some Rx meds are definately necessary but..... SEE Fibromyalgia and Fatigue Centers on the web. I have been going since last year and I have much of my life back. Yes, I have been being treated for heavy metal poisoning, hypothyroidism, bacteria, virues, adrenal gland fatigue, immune system disorder and on and on.. Bottom line, while good lifestyle habits are important...equally important is finding out all that is wrong. These Dr. are experts in the field and know what to test for and how to treat it. They don't just rely on Rx drugs but will Rx if needed. Vitamin deficiency, hormone deficiency and any other thing no one else in the medical field will test you for or treat you for.
Pass the word. I go to Philly area center. Hope one is close to you. Get help now.

[eaglesfurr]

Yes, I have managed to go to work as a teacher, in pain every day. I could barely stand up and stay awake. Some days in the past I would feel great and then I would over do it and crash for a couple of days. Yes, people would see me during the day now and never know anything is wrong with me but in the pm I can't make it through the evening without a nap. People progress through this at different rates, pains, fatigues etc. Each of us are alike yet different. There have been only 2 people are still working, I have me at the Fibro and fatigue center, getting IVs for whatever is needed. Teens and girls in their college years are there too. Fewer men, but they are out there. I was more fatigued this summer, later they found I had a very high level of a bacteria in me. I could not move during the day for one whole month. It took two days starting on antibiotic to feel better, luckily since school was starting in a week, I stayed on the anti.. for 5 months and also taking probiotics to keep yeast down. These doctors at Fibromyalgia and Fatigue Centers know what they are doing. Pass on the word.

I always wonder why pain is usually the issue disscussed when talking about Fibromyalgia. There are many other symptoms as well. The chronic fatigue is horrible and is often accompanied with some memory loss, inability to focus and depression. The clumsiness from the slight loss of muscle control is embarrassing- people tend to think you are drunk- and when a Fibromyalgia patient is in a real bad patch their speech can be a bit slurred as well. I know several people who claim that they have this disease, but when they describe the symptoms it is almost laughable. One woman I know came to me saying that her wrists were sore and her physician diagnosed her with Fibromyalgia. She works full time and plays tennis a couple times a week. Fibromyalgia patients usually need to cut back on their work hours, some have to retire altogether. Those of us that have this disease live what I call a half life. I get so angry when others claim that it is a syndrome that woman in middle age crises come up with for attention. Who in their right mind would want to live like this? My goal for myself is to keep that half life as good and as enjoyable as possible. I am looking forward to the new medications even though I am afraid of them right now. If anyone else is using these new medicines please share your thoughts.

[Lady Nimue]

Welcome eaglesfurr, and thank you so very much for your helpful contribution.....I know its appreciated.

[CirclingRaven]

Greeting Everyone!

I've been away from the boards for a long while, as there has been so much happening that I just couldn't find any time to post or even read.

I got this in another email today, so thought I'd finally visit and post this info for you all:


Cortisol may alleviate chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia symptoms: study
Last Updated: Wednesday, March 19, 2008

Sufferers of fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue syndrome may see significant relief from their symptoms when administered the stress hormone cortisol, finds a new study.

A review of 50 published studies conducted by researchers in California has found that people who suffer from chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia have adrenal dysfunction, meaning their adrenal glands, which produce sex hormones and cortisol, don't work effectively.

Chronic fatigue is a condition in which people have debilitating fatigue that may be get worse with activity and is not relieved by rest. Fibromyalgia is a syndrome characterized by multiple pain points in muscles throughout the body and fatigue. Chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia affect 0.5 to five per cent of the population, according to the study's authors.

"My review of existing studies suggests that a treatment protocol of early administration of cortisol may help improve and reduce the symptoms of chronic fatigue syndrome and fibromyalgia," said Dr. Kent Holtorf, medical director of the Holtorf Medical Group Center for Endocrine, Neurological and Infection Related Illness in Torrance, Calif., in a release.

Holtorf also conducted an observational study with 500 patients from his clinic, who received cortisol as part of their treatment. He found that by the fourth visit, 84 per cent reported improvement, with 75 per cent showing "significant improvement," and 62 per cent reporting substantial improvement.

The typical dose of cortisol adminstered to patients was 5 to 15 mg. Concentrations in the body were measured throughout the study using urine analysis.

"Cortisol treatment carries significantly less risk and a greater potential for benefit than treatments considered to be the standard of care for both conditions," said Holtorf.

The study is published in the winter issue of the Journal of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome.




Hope this is useful!

Blessings,
Circling Raven

[Chrysanthemum]

Twig-

I share your surprise in finding information on this subject here as well. I'm glad to hear people talking about it, though. For anybody dealing with Fibromyalgia and/or Chronic Fatigue (ME in Britain), I would suggest reviewing the following websites, which are foundations set up specifically for these diseases. Every case is caused by different factors in different combinations, so understanding the disease and your own symptoms is key to any recovery plan. In an effort not to get "preachy" I'll leave it at this.... you must be an expert on the subject and challenge your doctors. There is a reason they call it "practicing" medicine.

http://www.cfids.org
http://www.fmaware.org

Blessings

[Chrysanthemum]

Just one more thing I wanted to add to the thread...

I highly recommend the book From Fatigued to Fantastic by Jacob Teitelbaum. I realize it is a bit of a cheesy title, but the book is highly informative. Mr. Teitelbaum is seen as the foremost authority in the US on Chronic Fatigue (as well as a sufferer). I came across this book late in my search and wish I had found this book years ago because so many of my questions would have been answered earlier.

Just some more food for thought for those looking for answers.

Don't give up!

Chrysanthemum

[Chrysanthemum]

SEE Fibromyalgia and Fatigue Centers on the web. I have been going since last year and I have much of my life back. Yes, I have been being treated for heavy metal poisoning, hypothyroidism, bacteria, virues, adrenal gland fatigue, immune system disorder and on and on.. Bottom line, while good lifestyle habits are important...equally important is finding out all that is wrong. These Dr. are experts in the field and know what to test for and how to treat it. They don't just rely on Rx drugs but will Rx if needed. Vitamin deficiency, hormone deficiency and any other thing no one else in the medical field will test you for or treat you for.
Pass the word. I go to Philly area center. Hope one is close to you. Get help now.

The website for the Fibromyalgia and Fatigue Centers is http://www.fibroandfatigue.com They have centers in Atlanta, GA • Cleveland, OH • Dallas, TX • Denver, CO • Detroit, MI • Fort Worth, TX • Las Vegas, NV • Norwalk, CT • Philadelphia, PA • Portland, OR • Pittsburgh, PA • Seattle, WA. There is also an affiliate Center in the Los Angeles Area called Holtorf Medical Group. If you don't live near any of these centers- know that they will do appointments over the phone (after you do an initial evaluation in person). Also, if you live in the Houston, TX area there is a clinic called Hotze Health and Wellness. They don't say that they specialize in CFS or FM but they do the same treatments that the other clinics do.

Also, not to scare anyone off, but because these diseases are not fully accepted by the medical establishment many insurance companies will not cover the cost of treatment, which can be expensive. For example, my insurance company covers the bloodwork and the compounded Rx's and 60% of what is "customary and reasonable" which turns out not to be much in their minds, but its better than nothing. Anyway, it pays to ask!

[sphericaladdy]

I have had some very good results with valerian. I'm not sure what you can get in the States but here we can also get it in pill form. One pill before bed each night has really helped with stiffness and pain in the morning. My husband uses the sleepytime extra tea to get his, but I found it just wasn't strong enough for me.