Global Warming? Global Cooling?

[Myrde]

*rubs brows* Alright, its been awhile since I wrote anything, but I felt the need to, because quite frankly, I'm about to rip the hair out of my head in fustration.

I've decided to do as much research as I possibly can into global warming. There's alot of hype about it, alot of naysayers and such. But before I begin, allow me to just thanks the generation before mine for [bleeping] up our mother Earth worse than it already was, as has been, and then dumping the entire problem onto the laps of MY generation. THANKS! WE TOTALLY NEEDED THIS!

*grumbles angrily and flips thru his papers* I've done research into deforestation, how we're running out of useable waters, how sulfur and coal plants in China are screwing with the ecosystem, how the biggest extinction of species ever is being caused by humans, how we're all gonna die by solar flares, by plague, by over population, by giant floods, and by aliens. The things that are to blame for all this are communists, americans, chinese, dutch, corporations, mom&pop shops, the rich, the poor, the Left, the Right, Democrats, Republicans, Liberal, Conservatives, Teaparty members, the English, the Yanks, Blacks, Whites, Cyan, the Native Americans, the Muslims, the Christians, the Druids, Punk Rock, Modern Art, lack of respect, too many restraints, the collapse of society, and of course, worst of all, the Jews.

Ozone layer is collapsing, Ozone layer is filling in. Hot Winters, Cold Summers. Solar Activity, Lack of Solar Activity. more and More and MORE and MORE AND MORE!!!!

It's ridiculous! It's absolutely freaking ridiculous!! We are talking about the FATE OF OUR FREAKING PLANET and not a single goddamn person out there can agree on anything! We have no facts! No solid proof! The information is being interpreted eight different freaking ways to Sunday, and for every SINGLE AGENDA OUT THERE!

I know we're doing damage to the planet. I know we're trashing, it and polluting it, and harming it. But by HOW much?!? Global warming is my biggest thing! Will I have to look my grandchildren (if our species is even still around) in the eye and explain to them that the world is now a hot, desolate wasteland because my generation was unable to stop the greed and the corruption of the generation before ours and our own.

I have done insane amounts of research these past few weeks. And my verdict is this...

*he rips the papers in half and throws the away*

NOBODY knows WHAT they're talking about.

But if we want to talk about scenarios... well...

http://www.longrangeweather.com/global_temperatures.htm

This website has my "preffered" reality of what's going on. Because quite frankly, I have difficulty believing both sides and their extreme views. "OMG WE'RE MELTING, IT'S GLOBAL WARMING!!!" "OMG, ITS BLIZZARDING! WHAT HAPPENED TO GLOBAL WARMING!!" Therefor, at this point, I'm accepting a calm, logical middleground.

....yes, I get Global Warming is a misnomer and that it just means more severity in temps, storms, ect. I'm being bitterly sarcastic with this statements with the exclamation points.

Anywho, the website and the content on the different sections within it provide quite interestig bits of information. It is my fondest hope we are at the tail end of the warming and beginning to move to entering a cold period, although only time can tell.

Anywho, I beseech the wise and experienced teachers to offer their own view points; just don't present your own research findings. I have found those to be utterly useless. <_<

[Aitrus]

One of Michael Crichton's last book before he died, State of Fear, explores this quandry quite well. At the end of the book, he puts forth his opinion. It's along these lines (and I hope I'm not misquoting him too badly): Is the Earth's climate changing? Yes. Do we know by how much? No. Do we know how much of it is caused by humans? No. Do we need to enact costly legislation despite not knowing? No. Do we need more unbiased research (in the book he implies that just about all research on the subject is very biased)? Yes. In essence, he believed that it's immoral to spend vast sums of money on speculative issues when people around the world are dying of starvation and disease.

In essence, I think he agrees with you about how much confusion there is on the subject. Unfortunately, just about any study you want can be found to support any opinion on the issue, so claiming that "the facts don't lie" doesn't hold much water. I have the feeling that we'll never know.

Like you, I do think that we do more damage to the planet than we need to for our survival and comfort (deforestation, introducing species that don't belong to an area, etc.), but do I think we're destroying the ecosystem? The jury's still out on that one. I think the planet is capable of coming back from any damage we've done so far. I also think that change, the idea that nothing is static, is part of Nature.

[DJ Droood]

9 February 06
Michael Crichton: Big Oil's Favorite 'Journalist'

The American Association of Petroleum Geologists is presenting its annual journalism award this year to Michael Crichton, the science fiction writer whose latest book, "State of Fear," dismisses global warming as a largely imaginary threat embraced by malignant scientists for their own ends.

"It is fiction," conceded Larry Nation, communications director for the association. "But it has the absolute ring of truth" he told the New York Times.

According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, which reviews the work of more than 2,000 scientists from 100 countries, we humans are overheating the planet with our burning of oil and coal.

Dr. James McCarthy, a co-chair of the 2001 IPCC, summed up the findings not only of that panel but also of the National Academy of Sciences, the American Academy for the Advancement of Science, the American Geophysical Union and the American Meteorological Society, when he said, "There is no debate among any statured scientists working on this issue about the larger trends of what is happening to the climate."

The sole dissenter is a figment of Michael Crichton's fertile imagination.

http://www.desmogblog.com/michael-crich ... journalist

[Myrde]

*leans back in his seat, sipping tea* Honestly, I have got to stop releasing my hair-ripping fustration out on these forums. Poor representation of myself, but at the moment, this site remains the only place where I converse about this of such a nature freely.

DJ-- While you know that I highly respect your opinion, I'm afraid that small bit can be easily refutable. For every 10 studies that prove global warming, my research shows 11 that disprove it and counteract, and vice-versa. Manipulation of the facts seems to be very easy; finding the truth, however, seems nigh impossible.

Again, the Earth IS heating up. We ARE harming it. But as to wether its the natural cause and cycle of Her, something that I can fully see, or from our own making, again, something entirely plausible; I cannot say. The problem ISN'T that there isn't enough data, but rather, that there's too MUCH of it!!! None of it agrees.

[DJ Droood]

For every 10 studies that prove global warming, my research shows 11 that disprove it and counteract, and vice-versa.

I suppose in the end it doesn't really matter what you or I *believe*, and releasing more hot air into an inconsequential new age internet forum won't make much difference anyway,so enjoy your tea!

[Myrde]

releasing more hot air into an inconsequential new age internet forum won't make much difference anyway,

*plays a Rimshot on a snare drum after that and throws his drumsticks into the audience*

Goodnight folks! The comedy duo of the one and only DJ Droooooooood and Myrde will be here all week!

Heh, couldn't resist. :3 But this is true... sadly, neither of us are in any posistion. But all I was saying is that information on both sides of the debate is somewhat biased. :/ Still, with something of this magnitude, can we expect ANYONE to fully know whats going on?

[DJ Droood]

The Climate Changer Deniers Tango:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrURLJ6Vlsg

[Karl]

When I was small we went on a school trip to the canal. We had a go on getting a boat through a set of locks. One thing we were told was 'leave the system how you found it or the next boat will have lots more work to do'.

My opinion is that regardless of whether the world is heating up or cooling down, and regardless of how much this is or isn't to do with humanity, we should be causing as little disturbance as possible.

Yeah, I know as a race we've royally stamped our big ugly boot in the face of Gaia, all in the name of progress (pronounced 'profit') and now we're all in a big argument over what bruising we've caused, but if you can say I had my shoes off at the time (ie by using renewable energy/recycling/organically growing your own food) then at least we can have a clear concience when we're burnt to a crisp (or perhaps frozen in ice, depending on where you live).

"An it harm none, do what ye will" probably applies to the Earth too.

[Gwiwer]

For every 10 studies that prove global warming, my research shows 11 that disprove it and counteract, and vice-versa.

It might be worth your while to go back and investigate who was funding the various studies. You might find that most of those studies that "disprove" it are funded by petrochemical and other industrial companies with a vested interest in that particular outcome.

Gwiwer /|\

[Huathe]

For every 10 studies that prove global warming, my research shows 11 that disprove it and counteract, and vice-versa.

It might be worth your while to go back and investigate who was funding the various studies. You might find that most of those studies that "disprove" it are funded by petrochemical and other industrial companies with a vested interest in that particular outcome.

Gwiwer /|\

I sure agree with this!