FLAME BAIT: Dogs are 'smarter than cats'

[Kernos]

The intelligence of “a man’s best friend” has evolved at a greater rate than the less social cat over millions of years, scientists at Oxford University have claimed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/family/pets/ ... -cats.html

[treegod]

I read that socialability is a factor in dolphin's intelligence. So it makes sense.

[skydove]

I did take our dog Spice to dog training lessons which she learned bits from, even then she was never much good at retrieving and could turn a deaf ear to most commands. I can honestly say though that we have been well and truly trained by our cat and know our place which is mainly ensuring she has a full tummy at all times. (her swinging and pounding on the door at 7.30 am every morning makes you think a caged lion has escaped)! Whether this is intelligence or manipulative learning to get her own way I don't know. With regards to pet animals I think they have got humans all squarely beaten

[Art]

http://www.physorg.com/news200164470.html

[merryb]

I feel cats have much more dignity than dogs and yes I am manipulated by them. My cat Ray has not bonded with my dog poppy and although small and dainty in appearance runs up and down the stairs like a herd of elphants every night about 1.pm which wakes the dog and she barks and she gets shouted at for the barking -once that has happened Ray goes back to silent stepping. Pops falls for it every time.

On evidence I believe cats have got life sorted - whereas dogs are far more vunerable and needy and dimmer.

With blessing and light
Merryb

[reilz81]

well dogs are easier to read certainly but smarter not by a longshot imo cats are just too smart for there own good that they can trick these scientists or anyone really they let be seen only what they want to show us hence why mans best friend is a dog and not a cat cats are fickle they do what they want dogs just do as there told and foxes are smarter then them both

[Delian]

Well considering that black ravens are smarter than dogs and about as smart as chimpanzees, it has obviously nothing to do with the size of the brain. Women have smaller brains than men, that doesn't make them dumber, but that one was used nonetheless for decades to oppress women.

And as my mother would say: "Cats are smarter than dogs because they make you obey." Obeyance is not a sign of intelligence.

[treegod]

Why dogs are smarter than cats is sociability. The social nature of dogs puts certain pressures on a dog that a cat does not have. Cats, buy nature, aren't constantly wondering gaugeing "where is my place in the pack", and "what are they thinking/feeling?" and " and communicating their own intentions and feelings. They have more subtleties in life to consider than a cat that just "turns up" and expects the world to conform to them (by world I specifically mean human lackies) and doesn't have to expend as much brain power as a dog weighing up the social dynamics in the world around them.

Here's an example from dolphin social intelligence: http://www.world-science.net/exclusives ... -brain.htm

Just to play the dog's advocate

Cat's social catergories:
1. Prey
2. Danger (just for the cat)
3. Mate
4. Friendly
5. Not friendly
6. Young (just recognised by mother)

Dog's social categories:
1. Prey (needs pack communication and coordination)
2. Danger (needs pack communication)
3. Mate
4. My Pack
5. Other Pack
6. Dominant pack member
7. Submissive pack member
8. Young (recognised by all pack members, not just by mother)

Not just different in quantity but in quality too.

[reilz81]

i dont think that a pack mentality makes an animal any smarter cats do as they want because they have attitude they can walk into 5 or 6 different houses and each would call it a different name and get a feed all without the person that feeds it knowing thats intellegent if you ask me where a dog is loyal to its pack alone usually one master or 2 a cat doesnt really have a master they prefer to control us petty humans and they can see spirits and are very interested in magic and ritual i havent seen any dogs show as keen an interest as cats do i can see scientifically it might appear that dogs are more intellegent but they lack the subtleties of the mind that the cat possesses

[Susanne]

You know, I had my cats read this thread and they're laughing at all the silly humans right now.

[reilz81]

pmsl im sure my cat has astral traveled(which my cat is acustomed to doing) to read this post for a good laugh also

[treegod]

i dont think that a pack mentality makes an animal any smarter

Nor do I!

For me there is a clear distinction between dogs having a social nature and having a pack mentality. Sociability requires intelligence, pack mentality requires giving up intelligence for passive following. Dogs are an equal mix of both, though perhaps less intelligent than wolves since wolves have to survive alone and dogs don't have to be intelligent to survive, they just "look cute" and are fed lol. A bit like cats really.

cats do as they want because they have attitude

They do what they want. In other words they have no social challenges to make them think. Dogs have to contend with the subtleties of social dynamics, cats less so.

I make demands of my dogs: to your place, sit, lay down, stay, come here, go away, get down. There has to be intelligence to interpret and follow this and communication. Cats don't have to contend with any of this, they don't communicate in the same way and it's not so complex.

they can walk into 5 or 6 different houses and each would call it a different name and get a feed all without the person that feeds it knowing thats intellegent if you ask me

Doesn't require a lot of neurons to do that though. That's just opportunism lol.

where a dog is loyal to its pack alone usually one master or 2

In pinciple my dogs have to be responsive to all humans. My dogs have to be taught that my 2 year old nephew has priority over them, that they are not allowed to dominate him (which is dangerous) and in fact any human they meet they have to learn to respect. Cats just tend to ignore loud boisterous things.

a cat doesnt really have a master they prefer to control us petty humans

I can say I "have" a cat but he doesn't want to be controlled by or control humans. Actually I haven't seen him for months, so what he really wants is to be independent. In that way cats can be more intelligent.

i can see scientifically it might appear that dogs are more intellegent but they lack the subtleties of the mind that the cat possesses

I can see stereotypically how cats can appear more intelligent than dogs. The appearance of cats appeals to a more refined "aristocratic" image, whereas dogs appear more working class, following orders etc.

But serisously, what subtlties are you talking about exactly?

Intelligence is a many-faceted thing. There are many aspects of intelligence, some bits cats are better at, and some, dogs are better at. In this case it's the dogs socialbility that means their brains have to work harder. A cat's world has less social dynamics than a dogs, they don't have so much to interpret whereas dogs do.

From the article above:

“This suggests the co-operation and co-ordination needed for group living can be challenging and over time some mammals have evolved larger brains to be able to cope with the demands of socialising.”

[Zylah]

:mracorn:

The intelligence of “a man’s best friend” has evolved at a greater rate than the less social cat over millions of years, scientists at Oxford University have claimed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/family/pets/ ... -cats.html

The fact that dogs actively try to learn from us while cats do not is certainly no indicator of greater intelligence in canines.

But seriously - as you said, treegod, intelligence is a multifaceted concept. Many factors play into the ways we measure intelligence which are prejudicial from their inception; this is a problem even within our own species, which educators confront in the classroom. Where you have a wide variation, you'll also have a lot of difficulty defining specific parameters; the stereotypical 'absent-minded professor' springs to mind: people like that shatter the ceilings on IQ tests and perform brilliantly on the level of academia; but they'll forget to eat if someone of a more pragmatic mindset doesn't remind them, and if left to dress themselves they're likely to cause local epidemics of blindness.

Are they intelligent? Oh, very. Are they, in another sense, idiots? Yes, very much so. It sounds paradoxical, but there it is.

Given the fact that we haven't even really figured out our own neurology to the point of being able to effectively and impartially measure human intelligence, I hardly think we're qualified to measure the intelligence of other species, of whose thought processes we're even more ignorant.

So it comes down to subjective preference! I say my cats are much smarter than my dog, because although I love them all dearly, my dog annoys the hell out of me on a more regular basis than my cats do.