Druidry becomes an official religion in England

[Frog]

It has certainly made for an uncomfortable few days for me, having to put up with scorn and ridicule from the atheist taliban at work. It has also driven a wedge between me and the few Christians who were previously friendly but now see me as just as much a threat as the atheists after reading the Daily Mail hatchet job.

It has also made me question whether I want to be associated with something trying to become established as a religion. I have always had ambiguous feelings about the religious/spiritual-philosophical side of things and the current trends seem to be painting me into a corner in which I do not wish to be stuck.

Interesting comment Bob about all this.
For years there has been much discussion about equalities, rights to people to believe what they want, support who they wish and hold their own views.

And yet, one commission gives the TDN the right to claim tax relief and we're plunged back into the dark ages - made worse by the Daily Mail article. Whilst that woman was ranting about the "good times" it made me think: why should I worry about what she (and people like her) think?

I do wonder sometimes if articles like that are deliberately troll like to wind up people... but also to boost DM's online viewing count and news sales as everyone gets hold of the article to read (and be offended).


As for me - I think it's great TDN got the tax relief; it's a shame that in order to do so they've had to compromise the freedoms of belief within its members.

[Merlyn]

Not sure if the Druid Network wanted the press,
Knowing the distorted kind of things which are more often the case.

It flies in the face of our fundamental guiding ideal of offering our help to all without wanting payment for same, as payment is debt.. and in our world that is an imbalance of sorts.

The implications make my head spin, and my dragons want nothing to do with the idea of charity status. Charity yes, status...no.

Will we be asked to give$?
Will 'we' be seen as asking others for same$$$??? (that bugs me)

In other ways, becoming recognized as a spiritual path might be good, however this IMO should require a very real and new category apart from religion.
This brings to mind the failing attempts by other groups who fall to the feet of powers that be thinking befriending them could further their goals...
This as we already see causes infighting, discord and ultimately disenchants the group, spelling death to its original intent and goals, rather than what might have been thought.

Foods for thought as the dragons shake their heads..

Merlyn

[DJ Droood]

In other ways, becoming recognized as a spiritual path might be good, however this IMO should require a very real and new category apart from religion.

I agree with equality under the law, but do specific religions need to have the government's stamp of approval to be "legitimate"? On the one hand, it might be good to have enhanced legal protection against the inevitable backlash from a formerly Christian society in full retreat, on the other, why do some people need Caesar telling them it is ok to be who they are? I am more concerned that everyone, from the Jedis and secular athiests to the Hari Krishans have the same rights in society as the bigger and kookier cults like the Anglicans and Roman Catholics and Muslims...not so much that my particular little cult gets special mention.

[Claer]

I also think think it's born from a desire for power. Coupled with a significant amount of boredom!

I think boredom through out history has played a much bigger role in the creation of strife than it is given credit for. Some people have too much time on there hands!!!

[lavouivre]

I think boredom through out history has played a much bigger role in the creation of strife than it is given credit for.

Haha! someone write A History of Boredom right away!

Badger Bob, sorry you have an unpleasant time because of this news.

I hope OBOD stays away from boredom, power and politics so that we can continue to live as unlabelled as we can here.

I have only seen mutterings on the board about councils and breakaway factions, etc.

Can you point me to a few discussions on the board?

[Cannaid]

As for me - I think it's great TDN got the tax relief; it's a shame that in order to do so they've had to compromise the freedoms of belief within its members.

Can you provide some clarity on this point? Thanks.

[DJ Droood]

I have only seen mutterings on the board about councils and breakaway factions, etc.

Can you point me to a few discussions on the board?

no...my memory only retains for about 15 minutes, and I probably didn't read them closely in the first place...not really that interested in witchy UK politics...AND they have probably been deleted/pruned anyway...it has been awhile...search for "king Arthur" or "Council of British Druids" or some combination of those words and you might find something.

[lavouivre]

Thanks I will DJ Drooood
Am now about to read this:
http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/Lib ... uiddec.pdf
(posted by Bocan on a similar thread)

[Merlyn]

http://druidnetwork.org/en/community
The Order of the Yew,

http://druidnetwork.org/celebrants
To become a priest..

http://druidnetwork.org/en/enviroprojec ... nting/fund
And of course, donations...

Very druid, however..
It is put forth as if we all are members, kind of...by association..

All good intent, great ideas, though the one of "priest" is "not taking the title lightly" and puts a different spin from what we seem to consider in the OBOD, as "all grades are equal".

Merlyn

[lavouivre]

41 The Druid Network explained that it has set out what it considers th be a definition of Druidry and its practice within the Constitution. In formulating this, the applicants consulted other Druids organisations throughout the world and canvassed their views at to the core beliefs. Those organisations were asked if they considered whether the definition was right and they all generally agreed that it was, although some might have added to it. Whilst the level of understanding may differ between followers because it is an experiential religion, the definition used by the Druid Network represents a colherent statement of the care and basic principles of Druidry. Druid groups and members who avail themselves of the services of the Druid Network are asked to confirm their assent to the definition of Druidry and its practice as set out in its Constitution.

Well, I wonder if OBOD was one of the organisations contacted by DN.
Also, I wonder, with their definition, if the DN refuses to take into account all the agnostics and atheists that are members.
I wonder too if a definition of druidry is not limiting druidry, as all definitions do, especially when religion is concerned.
And finally, we have to sign an agreement with DN to give assent to their definition if we want to use their services. That's a tough one??
Another last one: does that mean that now OBOD is considered part of all this in the UK? What is our group involvement exactly?

It is put forth as if we all are members, kind of...by association.

Also this:

"priest" is "not taking the title lightly" and puts a different spin from what we seem to consider in the OBOD, as "all grades are equal".

This is what I was wondering too: being an official religion means tougher, more inflexible hierarchy. Don't know if it is true, I am just asking. We humans love pumps and circumstances, and titles. It reminds me: my brother was in free masonry for a while, and there were some skirmishes about ranks, power and politics within the brothers sometimes. To a bitter point for some.

[lavouivre]

http://druidnetwork.org/en/community
The Order of the Yew,
It is put forth as if we all are members, kind of...by association..

I notice though that OBOD is not in the community index (there are seed groups/groves from OBOD though).
I think I rather like that!
Let OBOD be independant and free for ever!

[DJ Droood]

Also, I wonder, with their definition, if the DN refuses to take into account all the agnostics and atheists that are members.

Yes, I too wonder why they didn't consult all 9 of them The wording of the pdf you posted above talks about all druids "respecting the gods", so can I sign up to be one of the first official druid heretics? Would the UK give me asylum?

Do you have to pay $$ to be part of the Druid Network? I honestly don't know anything about it.

[Oneonine]

They say in the Charity Commission report (which we all read fully before commenting) that members only pay £10 which isn't a considered a hardship.

[DJ Droood]

They say in the Charity Commission report (which we all read fully before commenting) that members only pay £10 which isn't a considered a hardship.

£10?!? That would be a nice meal!


What do you get for your £10? There are so many free druid newsletters and forums, I wonder how they make it worth the money.

[wolf560]

Hello All,

I see the recognition of Druidry as a positive sign.

Whether we see ourselves as a 'religion' or a personal pursuit of betterment (or we just like standing with nothing more than a robe on under the full moon, LOL). It all comes down to a personal choice and I feel that we represent Druids everywhere in everything we do.

The more people know about us, and the more recognition we receive overall the more accepting people will be in the end. When I tell people that I am a Druid I normally get a "huh?" to which I then say "I am a Celtic Shaman" and they all nod knowingly and smile.

Once they get to know me and I explain what the Druids used to be 2000 years ago they look around my house and truly understand.

[lavouivre]

well, I guess, if some are willing to pay... Right now, i rather need the 10 Pounds for a meal.
Druid heretics, here we come! (though i'd rather be around the stake than in. Maybe in the dead of winter I will change my mind).

[wolf560]

As long as the charity is actually doing something charitable, I'd have no problem with it.
Trouble is these days making sure of that....

[Oneonine]

I paid, got the access, and left again, Droood. Wasn't what I was looking for. Paying £10 to find that out afterwards might be a little harsh, but you get offered a refund if you want it so it's all good. I just said use it for tree planting or whatever, rather than take the refund. It would appeal to some and not to others, I think.

[lavouivre]

Hello All,
I see the recognition of Druidry as a positive sign.

Well, I can't help but be in two minds about it. However, my very first reaction was to applaud and see it as a kind of victory against christian dominion for the past 2,000 years. I just don't want druidry to become arrogant with recognition and change its great freedom of thoughts to a canon/non-canon religion. It might not end up that way of course. But reading the charity commission chart, I think there is a danger in trying to define too much and compromise to find common ground instead of letting individuals choose their paths.
As long as every druid in the world is conscious of these dangers however, then there might be nothing else to do but celebrate.

Oneonine, is it indiscreet to ask why you left, or what you were looking for in TDN that you didn't find? Just curious.

[Merlyn]

As I recall, early on, the OBOD kind of stepped aside from all of this, a few years back.
Also from a few other things of the sort.

Being years ago that this all began, as a process to this end, IMO it should have been reviewed prior to submission, as things change over time.

DN has it's own view and direction, however like to be a crossroad kind of "group of groups" and will be seen as speaker for many, if not all in this light. They do however have their own order, now, and this is kind of odd. I do not remember them having an order as such when all this began.

Being a druid 'priest' has its good and bad so to speak.
Nice to be able to provide a legal marriage, but if a priest then... pope next?

All of our ponderings are: like mine, conjecture and if we really want some good feelings, positive connection and all with the Druid Network, perhaps we can invite someone to discuss, explain and work to this end?

I think it would be a positive, perhaps before wild ideas run far afield

Asking the dragons to be patient,
Merlyn