So how druid do you need to be to be a Druid?

[Frog]

Hi all,
Prompted by another thread on the forum regarding air travel, some of the comments got me thinking the above question.

I recognise that the manner in which I live my life would not be how others would live theirs - eating meat, using air travel for example - but I do consider my impact and also offer guidance to future generations to do the same. I also recognise that with this fractured world we live in, where neighbours may not know each other, there is a great need to offer events and forums to enable people to meet up and share?

So - is recognising your decisions and taking responsibility for them druidic; or should you only consider yourself a Druid if you abandon those things you acknowledge to be "wrong" and live a pure life?

[DJ Droood]

So - is recognising your decisions and taking responsibility for them druidic; or should you only consider yourself a Druid if you abandon those things you acknowledge to be "wrong" and live a pure life?

Firstly, I don't think there is such a thing as a "pure life", although no shortage of people who claim to live one.

Secondly, I don't think it is an either/or proposition...you either follow all the "rules" or you are not a druid. Druidry is a spiritual practice that tries to avoid harm to the Earth and its inhabitants, and encourage health, and druid principles are those that align with this goal. If you violate a druid principle...or three, or five....it doesn't mean you aren't trying...it just means you have to try harder...find work-arounds...evolve your systems...druidry is a work in progress.


We all get to judge for ourselves how well we are doing, and make changes as we can. I don't think we can get away from the finger-pointing harpies...they are a fact of life in almost anything we do...it is my feeling that the enviro-harpies, comforming to the Law of Unintended Consequences, have caused the media-fueled public backlash against "environmentalists" and have done more long-term damage to the Earth than SUV drivers, by alienating people and encouraging them to tune out, (and tune in to ridiculous oil industry mouth-pieces who tell them climate change is a lie and their lifestyle is not a problem) Living by example is one thing...finger-waging from your rocking-horse is another.

[steampunkdragon]

So - is recognising your decisions and taking responsibility for them druidic; or should you only consider yourself a Druid if you abandon those things you acknowledge to be "wrong" and live a pure life?

I'm going to go with the former, not the latter. It isn't possible for most people to go without things nowadays that wouldn't be considered very druidic. I understand the argument of "people used to do it X way, you should too", and I counter it with "if you don't keep up with the times, you get left behind". If I refused air travel, I would lose my job... as I had to sign a waiver saying if I had to fly to the headquarters of the international company that owns us, I will do so. I couldn't practice the path for me if I had no money to buy my daughter and I groceries, or pay for the roof over our heads. Jobs are very hard to come by here, I will make the compromise.

As long as you are doing everything within your power to reduce, reuse, recycle, rejuvenate, and rejoice... then as far as *I* am concerned, you have earned your way, and your ability to call your way of life YOUR druidic way.

[Dendrias]

If I refused air travel, I would lose my job... as I had to sign a waiver saying if I had to fly to the headquarters of the international company that owns us, I will do so. I couldn't practice the path for me if I had no money to buy my daughter and I groceries, or pay for the roof over our heads. Jobs are very hard to come by here, I will make the compromise.

Wasn't the other thread about flying that was not necessary to do one's job? I would think that, when it comes to jobs, maybe the argument would have been different.

if you don't keep up with the times, you get left behind

That's what my pupils are saying when it comes to more expensive mobile phones, ipods, gameboys, psp2, flat-screen-dolby-surround-sound-systems, laptops ... I, for me, made a note in my calendar to watch whether or not "being left behind" really is "being left behind" for bad. If I should be "left behind" in case of SUV, Porsche, Lamborghini, any fast car, any expensive car, electric devices, crystal meth, big houses, big computers, a pool in the garden, flying into holiday every month, going shopping in Europe ... no, wait, I am in Europe, so going shopping in Paris, in New York, in Rio de Janeiro, in Rome ... well, then I'm not "left behind" all the celebrities, the rich, famous and beautiful.
To sum it up: Sometimes it's worthy to look at what "left behind" really means.

[steampunkdragon]

To sum it up: Sometimes it's worthy to look at what "left behind" really means.

When it comes down to it, that's a purely personal definition. My version of left behind isn't the same as someone else's... but living to far in the past that one would snub the future only damages the person who is doing the snubbing. I have to have a cell phone, but I don't have to have a top of the line one, so I don't. I also don't sleep with my cell phone... it stays in the living room. Each of these things is a decision that I have consciously made, just like the decision not to be a Ferrari owning meth mixing crack smoking conspicuous consumer who uses a personal Lear Jet to shop in Rio is a decision that you chose to make

[ElementalBeing]

I go for the first view too.

Hard enough to live by my own moral standards, without being lumbered with someone else's rules.

Mutual respect can lead us to greater environmental awareness, with enviro-police hassling us!

[Davin Raincloud]

This is why we 'humans' form orders and groups.

At the end of the day we should be able to freely express and associate with others as a Druid.

In reality, so many people decide that they don't like you and your interpretation, and they seek to invalidate you.

So it matters more what Druid Order your belong to, and what regulations you agree to .... in order to satisfay debates as to what and what is not Druidry.

People without orders, can pretty much call themsleves whatever they like.

There are two many "angry" Celtic Recons, Polythiests, Christians, Athiests, Druids and Buddhists (To name a few) in the world. These people (The Angry ones) suck all the light and fun from life..and are the anathema of the Spiritual life.

Peace and War are choices.

[Frog]

Thanks all!

I was thinking about this further after I posted. Long before I worked out the spiritual path I was on, I stood up and made a promise to become a Scout. Since then, I have stood up and repeated that promise many, many times. The Scout Promise and the Laws were modelled on what is best described as good, moral values - both in terms of the person and on the wider scope.

The Promise starts - "On my honour, I promise to do my best..."
For me, this is key to my life - it says that I will do the best I can to uphold good moral values and to be a contribution to society and the World, but I also recognise that I may make decisions or take actions which don't meet those goals.

I guess even if I had to relinquish my Scouting Warrant because of other things (work, time, health) I would still hold myself to this promise.

[Davin Raincloud]

LOl, I was also a scout!

DYB DYB DYB DOB DOB DOB

[Frog]

LOl, I was also a scout!
DYB DYB DYB DOB DOB DOB

Crikey Davin, that's going back a bit! I think that got dropped in 1968!
For anyone never in the Scouts (or Cub Scouts come to that) - DYB stood for "Do Your Best" and DOB "Do Our Best".
Anyone taking their Scouting seriously (rather than just using it as a place to meet their mates) would learn a set of skills which would help them throughout their lives.

[Lily]

another one here... certainly taught me to organize, improvise and not to mind a bit of dirt or cold...

[DJ Droood]

LOl, I was also a scout!

I was released from the Cub Scouts for refusing to take an oath to Queen Elizabeth and her Heirs and Successors. (although if William and Kate had ruled during that time, I may have made it through Rover Scouts.) I hated it and was glad to get back to my books. I am very disorganized now, but love to camp!

[Dendrias]

How druidic is refusing to take an oath to the queen? Wouldn't Your prehistoric druid-ancestors burn You in a wooden cage after, while and before beheading and drowning You?
Or is that another question?

[Bartholomew]

I have been following this thread and the other similar thread on flying. I do like DJ Droods and Frogs posts generally they are just good commonsense. Without being a creep, I lurk and read lot here and there. I think Frog is correct in saying that you can only do you your best with what you have and where you may lapse in one area of life in regard to the environment and making a diference to society you will have strength in another area. How many people give their time voluntarily to young people these days?
The poor I think will always have less impact on the environment purely because they cannot afford to keep up with the latest trends.I have never been on a plane, I am 46, that was not through a choice to be environmentally friendly, I have just never ben in a position to afford a holiday or trip abroad. I do have an old car that I paid £300 for to get to work because I live in a village where public transport is not good. I didn't have a car for a year or so and cycled to wok 5 days a week 10 miles there and back to do a crummy job cleaning a supermarket to keep a roof over mine and my kid's heads. You could say I was adding to the problem of consumersim by working for a supermarket chain. I may get rid of my car next year and work from home but I will have to use this laptop, which I didn't buy, it was given to me. I think we are all in this so deep now that there is no return unless there is a massive shift in the way we live and think and I don't think that is going to happen in my lifetime. I plug away with my complementary therapies and try to be of service in that way.

[Merlyn]

Greetings Frog,
Taking your question in the light you ask it:
We begin our life in a time far from what we may think the original drui had. I reflect though on the immense squandering of resource none-the-less by those of that time who could.
Nothing really different in the human sense, just more to squander now. So how do we feel about getting back to nature, having been born in a time so far from it, much has been destroyed, never to be recovered?
Opportunity, and the insight to seek and act on it. To me that is the challenge before us.
Very few if any of us are in position to act aggressively, make the world a better place over-all. Druids trend to be more passive aggressive, learning how to find the point of balance when the simplest push moves a mountain. In essence our study is to attune us well, bring our mind-body to act on the direction we feel is right.

That can mean great things. As I observe: the greatest opportunity to make positive change is in the midst of the worst possible times.
And right now... that is an interesting thing to ponder.

From the windy hill
Merlyn /|\

[Frog]

Greetings Frog,
Taking your question in the light you ask it:
We begin our life in a time far from what we may think the original drui had. I reflect though on the immense squandering of resource none-the-less by those of that time who could.
Nothing really different in the human sense, just more to squander now. So how do we feel about getting back to nature, having been born in a time so far from it, much has been destroyed, never to be recovered?
Opportunity, and the insight to seek and act on it. To me that is the challenge before us.
Very few if any of us are in position to act aggressively, make the world a better place over-all. Druids trend to be more passive aggressive, learning how to find the point of balance when the simplest push moves a mountain. In essence our study is to attune us well, bring our mind-body to act on the direction we feel is right.

That can mean great things. As I observe: the greatest opportunity to make positive change is in the midst of the worst possible times.
And right now... that is an interesting thing to ponder.

From the windy hill
Merlyn /|\

Hello Merlyn
Thank you for your post (actually, thank you to everyone that has contributed).
I know that in my lifetime I have been in a position where I have "wasted" resources - bought expensive items because I could; my life now is very different.
I would also say that through Druidry (and the Scouts!) I have got a much better picture of who I am - warts and all.

DJ - I have heard of people being asked to leave Scouts for many reasons, but I'll be honest the oath to the Queen is a new one!! But I do recognise that scouting isn't for everyone!

[Huathe]

This is why we 'humans' form orders and groups.

At the end of the day we should be able to freely express and associate with others as a Druid.

In reality, so many people decide that they don't like you and your interpretation, and they seek to invalidate you.

So it matters more what Druid Order your belong to, and what regulations you agree to .... in order to satisfay debates as to what and what is not Druidry.

People without orders, can pretty much call themsleves whatever they like.

There are two many "angry" Celtic Recons, Polythiests, Christians, Athiests, Druids and Buddhists (To name a few) in the world. These people (The Angry ones) suck all the light and fun from life..and are the anathema of the Spiritual life.

Peace and War are choices.

Davin,

I could have not said it better myself!

[cursuswalker]

This is why we 'humans' form orders and groups.

At the end of the day we should be able to freely express and associate with others as a Druid.

In reality, so many people decide that they don't like you and your interpretation, and they seek to invalidate you.

Tell me about it.

Regardless of what group I belong to, and what their definitions are, I am a druid so long as I call myself one.

That is non-negotiable, simply because it is exactly the wat the Druid Revival happened. People declaring themselves to be druids.

[katie bridgewater]

Regardless of what group I belong to, and what their definitions are, I am a druid so long as I call myself one.

That is non-negotiable, simply because it is exactly the wat the Druid Revival happened. People declaring themselves to be druids.

Including my great-grandfather, which makes it my family religion and me a hereditary druid...

[cursuswalker]

Regardless of what group I belong to, and what their definitions are, I am a druid so long as I call myself one.

That is non-negotiable, simply because it is exactly the wat the Druid Revival happened. People declaring themselves to be druids.

Including my great-grandfather, which makes it my family religion and me a hereditary druid...

Yay! authenticity!