Hunting and Druidry

[skydove]

It's not that I am oversentimental about cutsey wootsy animals and get an attack of the heebie jeebies everytime one dies or someone eats a pork chop. I don't fear death anymore than any other person I suppose, probably less than some because of my experiences and beliefs, and knowing that we are all fated to die one way or another does not make me rush to get out the frying pan and eat the said pork chop or feel that I need to go and catch a fishy for my little dishy. Its not a matter of looking at research either and justifying eating or not eating a certain thing because science can prove who or what suffers the most either hunter or hunted. Rather its stepping away from the whole eat and be eaten argument seeing that all life for me is sacred and choosing how I can act from that premise, simply by not eating meat I am honouring life in my own small way. As I said before this is personal I would not try to influence others to behave in a certain way and fully appreciate that others have to work out their own response in a way that they feel comfortable with.

[DJ Droood]

For me, it is about compassion and responsibility. The way animals are raised for meat causes horrific suffering and environmental damage. Hunting, road kill and local small farmers are easily the most ethical ways to harvest meat, but the vast majority of meat eaters get their food from factory farms and killing floors. It takes about 10 minutes googling to get the facts, or buy a book like "Fast Food Nation."

I don't lose sleep over it..there is a lot of horror in the world, and maybe I am too selfish to let it all bother me, or perhaps defeatest, or maybe prefer to focus on the beauty...I don't think anything is going to change with our food/transportation/war system until it all collapses...for now, I've just made a personal choice that makes me feel healtier and better about myself, and the only time I speak up is when people insist there is "no alternative" to the Double Down. Otherwise, put whatever you want in your mouth.

[reilz81]

im a vegetarian but i like the way the native americans go about hunting i dont know how the druids of old did it but the native americans would hunt and kill what they needed and use all of the beast not just the rump and through the rest away it can all be useful then its not such a waste imo

[dreamguardian]

im a vegetarian but i like the way the native americans go about hunting i dont know how the druids of old did it but the native americans would hunt and kill what they needed and use all of the beast not just the rump and through the rest away it can all be useful then its not such a waste imo

There was something mentioned on the programme 'QI' about how one NA tribe would chase the buffallo herd over a cliff to kill them. Many were left to rot as the tribe couldn't eat or use all of the animals. Not that in keeping with the harmonious image we may have.

The intention would not to be to wipe out the food source but ultimately the number one priority was to get food by whatever means.

There are various methods mentioned in the following books:

Briatain Bc by Prof Francis Pryor: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Britain-BC-Irel ... 643&sr=8-1

Native American - Canada
Journey to the Northern Ocean: The Adventures of Samuel Hearne: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Journey-Norther ... 034&sr=8-1

[Arth Frown]

I hunt for conservation reasons, mainly squirrels or rabbits. Squirrels strip bark off trees and eat birds eggs and rabbits eat saplings which can prohibited natural regeneration of woodland. It's a horrible killing seeing them twitch, but it something that needs doing. I give there bodies to the foxes and badgers.

[DJ Droood]

I hunt for conservation reasons, mainly squirrels or rabbits. Squirrels strip bark off trees and eat birds eggs and rabbits eat saplings which can prohibited natural regeneration of woodland. It's a horrible killing seeing them twitch, but it something that needs doing. I give there bodies to the foxes and badgers.

Nature is lucky to have you.

[Huathe]

Squirrel and rabbit makes for fine eating. As far as taste in concerned I had soon have squirrel to venison. Squirrel gravy is delicious!

[wyeuro]

i just had a goat killed, butchered him, and ate some, sharing the rest with friends and other farm animals - cats, dog and chooks, as well as making a meat offering to the crows, shrikes and jays. i have been dealing with the emotional surges and disturbances of our herd, which is not an unduly disturbable one, having come through the recent floods without much anxiety, and after thirty years of being a goatherd i know what they're feeling. there's a kind of bustling, unsettled feeling in the herd when it has animals to dispose of.

my little herd had two young billy goats coming on and it only needed one - the fittest for the role. the whole herd behaves at times like that like a pregnant woman, as if with labour coming on, and it begins to demand of the earth the means by which to give birth, through death, to the surplus buck(s) in the herd. i.e., it begins to announce it to predators, starting with its human predators, and if the human doesn't respond by harvesting the carcase(s) and thus releasing the spirit(s) into the ether (or wherever they're bound), that's when some poor idiot gets manoeuvred into letting his rottweilers run amok and they get in and worry the herd, and the poor dogs get shot, and they're only doing their job.

somehow, goats know their way round their death and do not fear it. it's a very unfraught event.
i say this to reassure people who fear the killing, and fear that meat-eating can't be justified because it's cruel to kill. it isn't. the goats are registering serenity and happiness today, on a high.
peace to all
wyverne /|\

[bioai]

It does dumbfoud me the number of meat eaters (generally speaking) who berate a respectful hunting practice (of only killing what you will use, and doing so as humanely as possible).
I do occasionally hunt, but what I kill I tend to eat (unless it turns out to be diseased, always check the kidneys...), I would never kill purely for sport, needlessly, or without being mindful of the life I am taking. I had a huge moral debate with myself before I took up the practice.
I was vegetarian (well actually, pescatarian to be precice) for 5 years when being a teenager and love animals (yes I drank milk and ate cheese although it had to have vegitarion renit in it, still the dairy industry is not without its failings either, so I should probabably have been a fish eating vegan.
The act of killing is never an easy one, and it always touches me deeply when I do kill something. That said, I eat meat, so why should I detach myself from the reality, these things (met portions) do not grow in their plastic packaging and to not experience the act of killing your food at least once I think is plain denial verging on ignorance (as arepeople who hunt for sport).
I hope this doesn't offend anyone, i is not my intent, I myself was ignorant of my meat source for 29 years by my own deinition, and 15 for my fish.
I also agree with a few of the posters above, that the hunting has kinded my spiritualliy and my connecting with nature, and this has partly contributed to my current spiritual path.

[DJ Droood]

I don't know if this ad for the new Dodge Outdoorsman is widely distributed, but I saw it on tv last night....it is revolting....I think responsible hunters everywhere and anyone else who cares about nature should be outraged...it does speak to not only the perception of the "ya-hoo" hunter, but perhaps an unfortunate reality that a segment of the hunting population buys into this sort of senseless killing...I think Dodge must test-market this stuff before they run it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvrG7lTuEQ8

[bioai]

Fully agree DJ, that's just wrong... unfortunately that type of attitude seems all too prevalent in my very limited experience

[Roost]

That advert's a bit disturbing - There's a cultural difference between the UK and North America when it comes to hunting, I tend to think it's a hangover from the frontier thing but I'm Welsh and spend my life surrounded by sheep farms so what do I know?!

I'm vegetarian and I avoid dairy products as much as possible. I eat eggs but generally only if I know and have met the hens. I'm not veggie for any "poor cute fluffy animal, I couldn't possibly eat you" reason. I have no issue with eating animals, I'll be lunch for the worms one day and anything else passing by (plus I'll feed the grass and the trees). I don't even have a big issue with farming animals but I have no knowledge of the life the animal has lead, how it was treated (I know some farmers around here truly respect their animals and other's who'll kick or beat their cows if they're not moving fast enough to be milked), how far it was transported before it died or the means of it's death, so, until the day I raise and slaughter my own animals I'll be vegetarian. Unless I learn to hunt in the interim, which I won't because I've got dreadful eyesight and I'm an appalling shot

I think hunting, if done with a druidic outlook, is just a further way to connect with the natural world. I'm in a position where I have the choice over whether I partake so, for a number of reasons, I don't - but that doesn't mean I'm separate from the cycle of life and death, or avoid considering and being aware of the death part of existence. It's just a different way of connecting with the world around me

[mantis]

I'm a former pest controller,grand son of a poacher and my uncles are game keepers.I also was a veggie for a year as a teenager when I discovered a intensive chicken farm near us ,as a personel protest.
I have been involved with hunting for a very long time,mainly dogs(I'm not a lover of guns),and I have never enjoyed killing,which sounds odd.It is at times a neccessary evil.As long as the reasons and the manner is as humanely as possible.Then it is part of the circle of life.
My Dad is a hypocrit,as he hates any form of hunting,but he eats meat.Wild food,gets a better life in most cases than any farm grown stock.Wild food is also healthy for you,because of movement(freedom to roam).
The subject of hunting will always be an emotive subject,but as Druids we must be all encompassing with the variety of views that we have.

[DJ Droood]

Wild food,gets a better life in most cases than any farm grown stock.Wild food is also healthy for you,because of movement(freedom to roam).

I could never get past the "gamey" taste of any wild meat I have tried...even wild boar, which I though would taste like pork, had sort of a goaty taste to it. Also, wild meat is too lean...I liked my meat to reflect who I am...fatty and sedentary. (or smoked and cured.)

[mantis]

Me and my kids are lovers of wild fare,I know know different really.My wifes a veggie(but does cook and prepare).
When we first met,she was very anti,so I did some PR work with her.First by showing the crop damage caused by rabbit and pigeon.Then I took her ferreting!She was first impressed by the teamwork of dog and ferret,and the enjoyment they got from there work.She also surprised how quick the rabbits were dispatched.Not everyones cuppa,but it needs to be done.She is still a veggie but an understanding one.She has been rat hunting by accident,and could see the excitment of it but was'nt impressed with rats flying over her feet.

[Pathfinder]

For me, it comes down to respect ... Respect for the Natural World we live within and our brothers and sisters.

An interesting note is a read the following this very morning in "Walking on the Wind - Cherokee Teachings for Harmony and Balance" by Michael Garrett.

"The people began to make weapons such as bows and arrows, knives, blowguns, spears, and hooks in order to kill animals, birds, and fish for their flesh or skins. And this was alright as long as the people followed the natural laws of Creation by respectfully informing the animals of their intentions, asking permission from the animal spirits, killing only when necessary for survival, using every part of what was received, and always giving thanks by making an offering (of tobacco) to the animal's spirit."

I've heard this from many places and felt the truth of it within as well.

[Huathe]

Me and my kids are lovers of wild fare,I know know different really.My wifes a veggie(but does cook and prepare).
When we first met,she was very anti,so I did some PR work with her.First by showing the crop damage caused by rabbit and pigeon.Then I took her ferreting!She was first impressed by the teamwork of dog and ferret,and the enjoyment they got from there work.She also surprised how quick the rabbits were dispatched.Not everyones cuppa,but it needs to be done.She is still a veggie but an understanding one.She has been rat hunting by accident,and could see the excitement of it but wasn't impressed with rats flying over her feet.

I eat quite a bit of wild fare too. Mostly deer and Wild hog but I also eat or have eaten Groundhog ( A member of the Marmot family. ) Squirrel, Rabbit, Bear and Snapping Turtle. And then there are those delicious frog legs and Crayfish. I have never tried Opossum or Raccoon.

Brian, my stepson tried Rat and Dog while serving in South Korea in the US Army. He said they were actually pretty good!

I am a big fish-eater and love to fish. To me eating your catch is at least half of fishing. Many people around here will only eat gamefish or " pretty fish " and will not touch less attractive species like Hornyhead Chub, Suckers or Bullhead Catfish just because they are ugly in appearance. Brian and Chris would not eat them until I cooked some up on a camping trip and they found them quite tasty. The key is CLEAN WATER. I also treated them to fish roe rolled in egg and coated in corn meal then fried. Damn good! They liked it!

Mentioning veggies, my dad did quite a bit of studies on herbalism years ago. I got one of his notebooks around here somewhere. Have you ever eaten dandelion flowers rolled in corn meal and fried? They taste like mild okra. Polk greens were a common fare. We ate stuff like Daylily tubers, Branch Lettuce, Creecy greens, etc. Dad also explored many natural remedies. Stuff like Willow Bark Tea and Yellowroot tea. Yellowroot tea is used for gastrointestinal problems and tastes really nasty!

I also drank Sumac Lemonade. I used to carry it in a thermos bottle to school and would carry Chinkapin nuts as a snack. Sumac Lemonade is made from the berries of the Red or Staghorn Sumac. I still remember how to make it. It really does taste like lemonade. Then there are others like Sassafras Tea, Spicebush Tea and Chicory Coffee. I still occasionally drink Sassafras tea. I can still remember my dad's stinking Ramps and Wild Onions!

Of course I did and still eat many wild fruits, nuts and berries. Wild plum, Wild Strawberries, Raspberries and Blackberries. During the late summer months I will head up into the high Appalachians to pick Wild Blueberries.

Dad was also very knowledgeable on wild mushrooms. We ate many types and many are really good. The trick here is knowing which are edible and which are deadly! If there is any doubt DON'T pick them! I know a few and will pick them for food. Ones like Coral Mushrooms, Morels and immature Puffballs.

I have also drank from many high altitude springs and creeks without getting sick. Lately I hear of a lot of people getting stomach ailments from water tainted by Giardia, a protozoan. So I bought me a filter to carry on my hikes and camping trips to insure clean safe water.

Hunting, fishing and harvesting has always been a important part of my life. Whether I get the food myself or from people who give it to me. A person with good enough knowledge can live off the land. My dad is one of those.

[Willowen]

I must say I have really enjoyed reading this thread because I thought in order to be a "good druid" I needed to become a vegetarian. Needless to say, this did not work for me. I did not feel well and found myself constantly craving meat. After going to a naturopathic doctor I learned that my body does not like chlorophyll much and my craving for meat is because my body needs the protein. I guess I'm just a carnivore at heart.
I have to admit that I enjoy hunting; however, it is something I approach with great reverence. I do not condone trophy hunting, and I only kill what I can eat. After shooting a deer I always say prayers of thanks to the animal's spirit.
I taught my son to shoot and hunt. I also taught him to give prayers of thanks and to kill only what he will eat. I insisted that he take a hunter safety class and I attended the class with him. I must say that I learned a lot from the class.
It has been quite a few years since I've been hunting, but I plan to go this fall with my husband. I am looking forward to it. And now I feel I can approach it without feelings of guilt.

[MPutnam]

Hey all, I'm not sure that I have anything to really contribute to this thread that hasn't already been stated but I'm gonna throw my two pence in the well anyway.
I see no issue between hunting and druidry though I have not always felt this way
I was a ovo-pescadoran veggie for 2 years and have not eaten red meat or pork for almost 3 years. This year I plan to go deer hunting with my father-in-law and I do plan to share in on the harvest.
My reasoning is as such: my father-in-law (as opposed to my father and step-father who are both hunters) looks upon hunting, not as sport, but as prayer. He is a Cherokee Native American and he has been hunting deer since he was a young man with his grandfather, father and brother. His elders taught him that whenever a deer is slain you must immediately thank it for the meat that will feed you and the hide that will warm you. Further, whenever he butchers the meat from the deer he leaves an offering for the carrion and scavengers in appreciation for nature.
Sure, he keeps mounts of some of his most prized deer but he can still pick up every antler in his house and tell you the story behind it (trust me, I've heard them all).

In response to a question that was posed in the early part of this thread that I don't believer was ever answered (sorry but I cannot find the quote now) "What if the animal you intend to kill is your power animal?" Well, the deer is one of my totems and I will have no issue honoring a deer to break my red meat fast. I plan to have my first blood's hide tanned so that I can use it in my shamanic works as a connection point.

Hope this helped a bit.

[Huathe]

MPutnam,

Your father-in-law does what all hunters and fisherman SHOULD do. Give thanks to God and the land for the gifts they provide. Thanking the animal itself is also a wonderful idea.

Have you seen the movie " Avatar "? Neytiri does this when she kills an animal for food or hides. She thanks the animal, the land and her deity for its meat and prays for it's spirit to be with Eywa The deity of her world.

It is something that I myself should heed.