My Daughter the Christian

[cursuswalker]

Ask her to ask this christian group where they believe pagans go after they die.

Then ask her to follow up by asking if that also applies to her mother.

[DJ Droood]

If it is a male teacher, I think you should ask his wife out on a date...offer her red wine and fine dutch chocolate to meet you and talk about your stamp collection, or something.

[Dendrias]

Ask her to ask this christian group where they believe pagans go after they die.
Then ask her to follow up by asking if that also applies to her mother.

Yes, that would be great. You can find out whether they are Christian or "christian". Every evangelist, pietist, reborn-Christian, bible-weaving Christian will have the same answer. Holyday-xmas-halftime "christians" might think about whether it's too harsh to say that, "of course pagans go to hell like any other satan-worshipping infidel."

You want, cursuswalker, that a young person knows what the opinions to the young person's dearest are, don't You?

[Bartholomew]

I don't believe in a place called hell. Only the most stupid and ignorant of people would have the audacity to state as a matter of fact where we go after this life. If people go into Christianity in a little more depth and do a bit of digging, there is some evidence that reincarnation was one of its tenets. If I have still got it, I will put the research I did on this here. If it was, the removal of that belief has completely changed the message of Christianity.
None of my children are baptised nor do they believe God or Jesus and I don't think for one second that they are heading for hell.

[cursuswalker]

Ask her to ask this christian group where they believe pagans go after they die.
Then ask her to follow up by asking if that also applies to her mother.

Yes, that would be great. You can find out whether they are Christian or "christian". Every evangelist, pietist, reborn-Christian, bible-weaving Christian will have the same answer. Holyday-xmas-halftime "christians" might think about whether it's too harsh to say that, "of course pagans go to hell like any other satan-worshipping infidel."

You want, cursuswalker, that a young person knows what the opinions to the young person's dearest are, don't You?

Absolutely. When you try to pin the religious down on such specifics you can find out a lot about what they really think and what they are too embarassed to admit to.

My mother was evangelised when young and remembers being convinced her own parents were going to hell. The people who did that to her were SCUM.

[Heddwen]

Ask her to ask this christian group where they believe pagans go after they die.
Then ask her to follow up by asking if that also applies to her mother.

Yes, that would be great. You can find out whether they are Christian or "christian". Every evangelist, pietist, reborn-Christian, bible-weaving Christian will have the same answer. Holyday-xmas-halftime "christians" might think about whether it's too harsh to say that, "of course pagans go to hell like any other satan-worshipping infidel."

You want, cursuswalker, that a young person knows what the opinions to the young person's dearest are, don't You?

Absolutely. When you try to pin the religious down on such specifics you can find out a lot about what they really think and what they are too embarassed to admit to.

My mother was evangelised when young and remembers being convinced her own parents were going to hell. The people who did that to her were SCUM.

I don't think its an embarrassment issue at all, cursuswalker, and I know nothing of hell or satanists. But, I am aware of the shadows/negative energies that exist attached to some personality types. I have been at the brunt end of situations that I would never go near again.
I would certainly never invite it anywhere. Best to avoid the thing totally, IMHO.Certainly I wouldn't want children exposed to this type of thing, much better to create a warm and loving sacred space in which to raise them and to keep them SAFE from harm.

[Bartholomew]

The concept of hell or hellish realms is not just present in Christianity I may add. I'm looking at this and that and I am wondering if there are spiritual planes of existence that are universal, but they have been interpreted differently in different religions and belief systems.
Buddhism for instance says that one can be reborn as a God, a Demigod, human, animal, hungry ghost or a hell being, depending on the karma accummulated in the present life. Buddhist texts speak of multiple hot hells beneath the earth, although illusory , the suffering of the Hell Beings and Hungry Ghosts in that place is excruciating.

Hinduism says a soul which falls into the darker world gets a taste of the horror and evil it tried to promote on earth with a multiple effect and with an intensity and severity that would make it realize the horrors of evil.
So maybe the Christian concept of hell belongs to a universal concept afterall.

[cursuswalker]

I don't think its an embarrassment issue at all, cursuswalker, and I know nothing of hell or satanists. But, I am aware of the shadows/negative energies that exist attached to some personality types. I have been at the brunt end of situations that I would never go near again.
I would certainly never invite it anywhere. Best to avoid the thing totally, IMHO.Certainly I wouldn't want children exposed to this type of thing, much better to create a warm and loving sacred space in which to raise them and to keep them SAFE from harm.

Then best make sure nobody tells them there is a hell. In my opinion doing so is abuse.

[Bartholomew]

Well that's all the religious education teachers fired for abuse in my kids school. As they have been taught all about the different religions around the world with their different slants on heaven, earth, hell and the meaning of life, as attriuted to each path. Tough one that Curcus.

[cat]

Um to set the cat in the pigeons so to speak.

RE needs to be taught unbiasedly.

When i was at secondary school our RE teacher made us answer some questions about christianty (he was a C of E revrand) i put that i did not belive in god. This got me put in detention. We never realy discussed religion in this class he just taught us what he belived and missed out the rest of the curriculm other religions. I was brought up in a family where i was allowed to find out about any religion i wanted to and decide for myself. (My mum used to be a sunday school teacher in here youlth)

We later got a teacher who taught us what the basise of the worlds main religions were and didn't allow his own belifes to infulence this. which in many ways was much better.

I formed my own opions and beliefes i guess which didn't fit with most. These days i take people as they come which means i have to decide if i like them or not but this isn't based on there belifes it's based on how they treat me and others. Religion trys to answer the big questions in life and helps many people live and for thouse who have a faith must be wounderful to have that comfert and guidance.

I can't realy comment on how to raise a child myself as i'm not a parent. Openess about religion helped me as a child/teenager. If you have any friends of other faiths that you trust then maybe a disscussion with them may be useful . personaly I kinda of find that when it comes down to it most faiths boil down to the same thing /things. It's how you live your life that matters is the way that i see it.


I love the Spirit of openess that we have here.

[DJ Droood]

I like it when they teach children reading, writing, arithmetic, science, history and languages. A little Phys Ed doesn't' hurt either. Leave the cultural stuff to parents, or maybe as extra curricular activities for older school kids (maybe 14+) I suppose a lurking pedophile is not much more likely to be involved in the Christian Club as with the Chess Club...and the older kids have more defenses/street smarts.

[cat]

I've never come across a extra curricular bible study group in the uk in a non faith school before.. but then its a long time since i went to school as a pupil. Balance is the key in education i think . Culture is a massive subject and travel broadens the mind they say.

[cursuswalker]

Well that's all the religious education teachers fired for abuse in my kids school. As they have been taught all about the different religions around the world with their different slants on heaven, earth, hell and the meaning of life, as attriuted to each path. Tough one that Curcus.

Not if you teach it as fact (the content of the belief, not the fact that such beliefs exist).

Telling a child that they might be tortured for ever when they die is abuse.

[Bartholomew]

Balance is the key in everything Cat. I don't know or have not been aquainted with any Christians who push the concept of hell and damnation onto children in this day and age to be honest. I know it was used a lot in the past by the Hierarchy in the Catholic church to control people, that no longer seems to be the case, in my experience, I can only speak as I find. All of my children attended a C of E primary and junior school and seemed happy with the hymns and prayers in assembly. They laughed at the vicar and really did not take much of it to heart. They went to High School and learnt about different religions and cultures and at the moment none of them follow any spiritual path. That may change when the trials and tribulations of life come along and they have some soul searching to do. I don't push anything onto my kids at all, we talk, we discuss, we leave it at that.
Have you any children yourself Curcus? Are you familiar with the curriculum used in education in most schools these days?

[Dendrias]

Down here, there's a bunch of fundie christians, called the piet-cong by some. And my brother-in-law, well, he's in there to quite a degree.
When he still was in school, he told that he and his bible study group did the service at the beginning or ending of the school year. And that afterwards they weren't allowed to do so, again. "But" he said "you have to tell children, that they will come to hell eternally if they don't give their life to Jesus Christ our saviour. You just have to tell them."
That's why I mentioned that "real christians" of course will say that every pagan will burn in hell. It just depend on what kind of "real christian" you ask.

PS: I don't think that curricula are similar in different parts of the world.

[DJ Droood]

That's why I mentioned that "real christians" of course will say that every pagan will burn in hell. It just depend on what kind of "real christian" you ask.

During my classes to become confirmed into the United Protestant Church of Canada (I think I was 12 or so) we were told directly by the Reverend Davis that Catholics go to Hell. I kid you not. I later married one.

[Aitrus]

I'm the kind to believe that every Path, whether it be Christian, Pagan or otherwise, has the potential to be a True Path. It becomes a True Path if the person has a) faith in what they believe, b) their soul has no misgivings about their beliefs and c) that they don't try to tell others what to believe. Not every person can fit on one Path to the Divine, but every Path has equal validity. If there were one correct and unarguable Path, then we wouldn't have all the religions we do have. Personally, I think that the Divine (whatever form He/She/It/They takes) meant for there to be different religions so that every different World View has a path to understanding.

http://www.religioustolerance.org is a great website that covers just about every religion pretty well, and in a very unbiased manner. I'd direct any teenager looking to explore their spirituality there.

For my own children (aged 4 and 8), whenever they ask about God or "Grammy's Church", I don't try to influence their beliefs in any way. I tell them that some people believe in God, some don't, and that's ok. My goal is to teach them to think for themselves, not to take anybody's word on so many things, that they need to do research and decide for themselves what they want to believe based on their findings, logic, and what their heart and soul tells them feels right.

Just my 1/50th of a dollar, but hey, there it is.

[Dendrias]

we were told directly by the Reverend Davis that Catholics go to Hell. I kid you not. I later married one.

You married a reverend? Or a kid?

[cat]

That's why I mentioned that "real christians" of course will say that every pagan will burn in hell. It just depend on what kind of "real christian" you ask.

During my classes to become confirmed into the United Protestant Church of Canada (I think I was 12 or so) we were told directly by the Reverend Davis that Catholics go to Hell. I kid you not. I later married one.

we were told directly by the Reverend Davis that Catholics go to Hell. I kid you not. I later married one.

You married a reverend? Or a kid?

Er is the a off topic smilye we can use around here! Got to love it when people start miss quoting


.

[DJ Droood]

That's why I mentioned that "real christians" of course will say that every pagan will burn in hell. It just depend on what kind of "real christian" you ask.

During my classes to become confirmed into the United Protestant Church of Canada (I think I was 12 or so) we were told directly by the Reverend Davis that Catholics go to Hell. I kid you not. I later married one.

we were told directly by the Reverend Davis that Catholics go to Hell. I kid you not. I later married one.

You married a reverend? Or a kid?

A catholic, silly. And Hell isn't half bad.