I'm a little confused with some of this Attila, are you suggesting the likes of a CIN are autonomous in or of themselves or are more akin as a potential, needing the interactions of a biological (or other) entity?
Attila wrote:Quite possibly. I don’t know if there is intelligence involved though I’d assume so, when information communicates in our minds it is intelligent so why not the same everywhere?
Attila wrote: Equally there is the question as to weather or not said intelligences are conscious or not, they could be acting as like a computer does ~ kind of mimicking intelligence mechanistically.
Attila wrote: In our brains some communication is conscious and some is not, so there seems to be a requirement of an experiencer or user - we could say.
Attila wrote: Now, is the experiencer or mind in us created by our conscious network? If so then surely CIN’s would make patterns too and so become conscious in some manner?
Attila wrote: Either way there does seem to be information networks out there and they work with our experience as like with the wolves, we feel something about that when viewing it on nature shows, no? I am seeing it everywhere I look these days.
The CINs you refer to may be thought of as the software environment. Let us then assume the environment we live in is the hard-drive.
My limited understanding of what constitutes consciousness is bound to weather something has any perception self awareness. If consciousness has self awareness then we would have to consider why such a thing would want to mimick anything.
Alternatively, we could say there would need to be a conduit for the collection of any and all CINs. Would this conduit therefore, need to be conscious in order to have an effect?
Or are our minds the products of interactions with the CINs, both interdependent and symbiotic in nature?
Once any CIN has interacted with a biological entity through its CPU (brain / mind), it is changed through the processes that use the information. The processing in itself, I would suggest, has a measurable effect therefore that CIN cannot be the same as it once was (unless you know of a way of back engineering this process, which for arguments sake, let us assume such a thing is not possible).
One of the things that seems to be hardwired into humanity is emotions. So the processing of a CIN may introduce into that CIN a previously unknown quality, namely emotions. Something that at this time, we are unable to scientifically compartmentalize enough to make testable.
Many people may consider an emotion to be an entirely internal process confined to the internal working of the ego. Yet instinctively we have all at sometime experienced an atmosphere in a place, not measureable as yet, but there non the less, therefore at least hinting at the idea of emotions being capable of existing seperately from a human. And if this is the case, then using the computer analogy, the output from our own processing as well as that from other entities that share our software (CINs and otherwise) may be part of the answer as to the ability of CINs to interact with us in ways that you initially proposed.
This processing may allow some attributes of independent existence on otherwise seemingly inanimate packages of information.
Attila wrote:An AI would be a mimic of intelligence [conscious] if there were nothing experiencing it, no user. You could have something that ‘acts’ exactly like a human but that doesn’t make it one, it would merely be a puppet to a script.
Attila wrote:Good point, there seems to be something [a conduit] within the context of the conscious experiencer. Well we can change info in our thoughts [free will], but the subconscious does also. So CINs could be similar to our subconscious, certainly I’d expect them to be so in the main, but that doesn’t mean they don’t form their own conduits?
Attila wrote:Hmm again good point, this leads to a far wider topic concerning purpose and perhaps evolution. I agree that you don’t just arrive at conscious minds/networks, and so we have to take both our positions into context, mine is that our consciousness exists due to the CIN of our brains information network, hence a similar network in nature may achieve the same thing.
Attila wrote: Perhaps the slower process is in the reprogramming which changes the hardware via its genetics.
Being an animist, I can't really conceive of there not being a user.
There is a danger here of equating consciousness purely with the higher mental functions of thought. It is my contention, and has been for a number of years, that the unconscious aspect of the human is actually the largest "consumer" of intellectual resources.
Attila wrote:Interesting point! But imho animism at its base is also the base of existence, you can make say a female deity manifest from its fabric [I.e. of reality] and make love to her, or even just her pubic region [where the invisible part of her remains but is part of the empty fabric]. It may be ‘the eye’ that lets you pass into the hidden realms, and any such thing usually represented symbolically.
I would think there is that which makes manifest and that which is manifested, so a conscious-less automaton or robot would be the latter [no different to a rock] ~ unless made in such a fashion as to be golem-like [golemic] and hence posses some manner of supernatural force.
The CIN’s operating near to and with that base become matter in a similar way!
Attila wrote:I agree it is, but I disagree that the subconscious is in any way conscious ~ more reactive to the requirements of the soul and its bodily medium the consciousness.
With respect, your idea of conscious-less appears to be based on human frames of reference. I actually believe there may be other frameworks involved outside the immediate sphere of the human.
Why would the subconscious require consciousness to operate? If we accept that when we sleep, for example, it is the subconscious aspect that is "operating" the human body, does that operation need the higher functions of consciousness to work?
Can you clarify the terms CIN, GCIN and NCIN?
In relation to a CIN
what is a human?
What is a tribes collective unconscious?
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